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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Here's the deal.... I know i can put my smallblock 327 under the hood of my SL, and i'd love the benefits of 500 turnkey HP. But there is no possible way to do it with FWD... So i'd have to run RWD (which i would rather anyway). I'm debating on pulling the posi rear-end out of my old Z28, but i'm not sure of the dimensions of either of them...... another tricky part would be the transmission, since stock, the SL doesn't have enough room to put a TH-350 or 700R4 (i don't believe so anyway)... I also want to keep all the luxuries that come with the SL (such as active suspension, which would be pretty much impossible with the camaro rear end). There's no doubt i can make enough room for the engine, even if i have to use a blue-tip wrench to make some room......but fitting a transmission in is going to be the hardest part.....

So if anyone has any advice, tips, or tricks to help me make it any easier.....enlighten me, i'm planning on doing it after this winter with no help at all....

Btw, has anything like this ever been done, and if so, could i get the email addy of the person who did it? Putting a Smallblock Chevy 327 in an SL......sounds like a daunting task to me.
 

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you are crazy man.
there was once someone that converted and awd to rwd but I don't know if there would be enough room for the tranny like you said. Very unlikely.
 

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You have two options:

1. Flip your transmission around

2. Push the shifter all the way to the right and pull back. Now you are in reverse. Somehow convert your interior to mirror image it now and drive the car like that. Now you have a RWD midengined car. Have fun going 40mph.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Wow, that's a great idea wild....almost as good as your exhaust idea. Someone call the darwin awards....

By the way, how would that be mid-engined? LOL.......taard
 

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Only "taards" dont understand sarcasm. And it would make it mid engined because the engine would be behind you when driving...think about it.

And what fuckin exhaust idea are you talking about? The one when my cat came unbolted because the shop is run by re"taards"? That wasnt me doing that mod if you can even call it a mod.
 

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sorry I let you down with it. She really did "pur" or "roar" for that matter with it disconnected.

But in all honesty, to convert our FWD to RWD would require so much work that it would be cheaper to buy a new Modena or something. That is unless you know how to manufacture everything and do it yourself.
 

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awild said:
sorry I let you down with it. She really did "pur" or "roar" for that matter with it disconnected.

But in all honesty, to convert our FWD to RWD would require so much work that it would be cheaper to buy a new Modena or something. That is unless you know how to manufacture everything and do it yourself.
Maybe, maybe not.

No one has done it, so how do we know it cannot be done and is not easy?

If you're putting in a small block Chevy engine, why couldn't you toss in some transmission that the Chevy guys use... then just modify the length of the driveshaft. :confused:

Of course you'd have to make some custom mounts and maybe a bit of cutting on the frame in the transmission area, but what else would there be?
 

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This sounds like a great idea and i've spent a few hours daydreaming through work, working it out in my head.

As far as the trans tunnel, you'd probably have to strip out the interior and console, cut the floor out and fabricate a new "tunnel" for it out of 18 or 20 gauge sheetmetal. It would be pretty easy and wouldn't have to be too pretty as carpet and that console would cover it all up anyways. There is plenty of room down there because i was adjusting my shifter and i would say there are 5-6 inches of empty space under the shift boot. You could just trim the bottom of the console until it was the original height. If you're going manual, it'll be easier because manuals are much smaller than automatics. With a 500hp SBC however, you're probably leaning towards a strong TH-350 or -400. I'm assuming things, so don't get too upset! :)

With the axle out of the camaro idea, that's exactly what i had in mind when i was thinking it over. It wouldn't be too tough with the sizing, as long as the camaro rear-end was wider. You can always have a shop cut the axle tubes and axles down to size. I think you could even mount the suspension from the camaro in the stock shock towers, with a little modification. I just don't know how the body would hold up to the torque of that monster small block being funneled out to the wheels. Another possible problem is the gas tank. If i remember back to when i replaced my fuel pump correctly, it sits pretty close to the rear suspension.

Up front in the engine bay, it would definately have the room to fit in there but once again, i don't know if it would stand up to that hot mouse motor. Everything in there looks pretty "flimsy" to me when i looked at it. Also it wouldn't fit under the hood, which is a good thing since it would be an excuse to put a really cool cowl hood on it. If it's just the air cleaner, you could make a neat "shaker" air filter with the hole in the hood like the old 'cudas and mach 1 mustangs.

Finally, you'd have to figure out the front suspension. This is where i always get hung up. You would have to completely redesign the whole steering system. I would think the best way to go would be to get a steering box out of a camaro or late eighties monte carlo and fit that in there. It would ake some enginuity (sp?) but would definately be doable.

Sorry for the long post and i'm ready to be flamed for my lack of technical expertise, but i thought i'd share some of my ideas on this subject with you. It's awesome that you're thinking of doing this. I'm in love with older cars and my stealth is the first car without a V8. Even from the first time i drove it, i thought it would look better with a 350 bellowing out pipes, leaving a haze of smoke boiling off the back tires, and i hope you can do that. Good luck and hit me back with some ideas and criticism of mine. I'm sure we can come up with a good plan, even if it never makes it off paper. Later guys

Paul
 

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To my knowledge no one has ever gone from FWD to RWD. The undercarraige of the nonturbos is different from the AWDs. You'd also have to get a gas tank from a VR-4 (shaped differently to allow for more clearance).

AWD to RWD has been done before. And the car handled like shit. Used Porsche rear-end gear to pull it off. Had to rotate the engine 90 degrees and modify the hood for clearance.
 

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To my knowledge no one has ever gone from FWD to RWD. The undercarraige of the nonturbos is different from the AWDs. You'd also have to get a gas tank from a VR-4 (shaped differently to allow for more clearance).
The fuel tanks are identical. I've had both in my car. The only difference is the bolt in fuel pump carrier.

There's just as much room under the back of the FWD model, but the actual suspension mount points are different from the AWD car.

As for modifying the front of the car to accept a transmission, everyone seems to keep forgetting the steering rack and front cross member sit up there. Even if you do relocate those, you'll end up intruding on the footwells which will probably mean relocating the pedals. The heater and AC cores are also up under there, so that's something else to consider.

I'm sure it can be done, but there's a lot more to it than just hogging out a trans tunnel and bolting in a live axle.
 

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Buschur has a racing atx tranny on his rwd eclipse. I am not sure about the model but it isn't ford or chevy. I think it is the mopar tranny, but you can change the output shaft so you can run any tourqe converter on it.

If you want more room for the rear supsension why not add a vr4 suspension in the back?

Would it be possible to use the rear axle from a vr4 and just have the yoke from one driveline welded on another?

The rear end in vr4's is limited slip right?
 

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Do you think that the VR4 rearend would hold up to the kind of power he is wanting to produce? I have no idea but i would assume it would be too weak. Don't they only put like 40% of the power down to the ground where the front puts down 60% or so? I'd think that because of this, they wouldn't have gone through too much trouble beefing it up to handle any more than, say 300 hp due to the increased cost to produce it. I'm just wondering and i have absolutely no idea. :)

Thanks
Paul
 

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The torque split is around 50 50 most of the time, but it is supposed to be a little rear bias. I think its like 48 front 52 rear. In any case, I still don't think the rear end will hold up as well. And since he has a FWD he can't use the vr-4 rear end anyway. He would have the excact same issues that everyone else talks about when converting the FWD cars to AWD. Its just not feasable, the frames are too different.
 

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acutally it WOULD be mid engine. Mid engine cars include any car where the engine is situated between the rear wheels. It becomes rear engined when you put the motor behind the rear wheels.

I think this is a doable idea, i just don't know how well the body and frame would hold up to the amount of twist a big motor like that would put on it. Anything is possible with enough money and time put into it. Kind of like how everybody said that a TT ES would never exist because it was too expensive and difficult. It probably wasn't practical, but someone did it. The question is if it would even be a stealth or 3kgt when it was all done with, or just a tube-chassis car with the skin on it. I still think it would be cool with that big V8 bellow coming out the exhaust pipes, though. This is actually a project i want to try when i have the time, money, and experience to handle it. If you're good working with metal and fabricating parts, it's doable. hehehe I just looked back at this post and realized it doesn't make a lot of sense. oh well, eh?

Paul
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I'd like to get the entire engine to fit under the hood, with no cutting or new hoods... I realise it might be a couple inches too high, if so, i'll hide it as best i can.. I want it to look exactly stock, but have the big V8 rumble. I'm even planning on using the stock exhaust (use flexpipe and a torch to connect the bigtube headers to the stock exhaust). I'll put 2 highflow cats (if i have enough room), but the tips will be stock for sure.

You were right with the TH-350/400 idea, i have two of each in my parts shed back home. Right now the 327 block is in one of the "Thunder-Trucks" my father and i built (dyno'd at 530whp with a 400 holley [going with my 750 quadra-jet in the SL]).

Here's the truck the engine is in....



We're taking the 327 out because my father just finished building a 383 stroker (against the rules, but they dunno that).

I'm sure i can finagle my Z28 rear-end under the SL. It would actually be a lot more complicated to do so if it were AWD, so in this case FWD is a blessing. I already know i'll have to custom fit my driveshaft, but that won't be too tough, we do a lot of that building the race-trucks. I'm just worried that i won't have enough room for the transmission..... I'll make all the motor/tranny mounts myself. Planning on welding some big brackets directly to the frame of the car so i don't have to worry about the engine breaking loose. I'll also have to make some reinforcements for the frame itself, so the engine doesn't torque the whole car and twist the frame (seen it happen to a camaro, nasty sight).
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 · (Edited)
I'll still probably have to put at least 50's in the back to beat a stock VR-4.......

But it would be a great feeling to pull up at 3000GT gatherings with that bad ass V8 big cam (500/500) rumble..... And it would be one hell-fired SL......


EDIT::::::

Oh yea, instead of the rear-end out of my Z28 (which currently runs great), i'm going to take the rearend out of my firebird (which is parked near the woodline in back of my house, no motor or tranny). The firebird rear end is Posi as well, and it's geared slightly higher, which would be better for the horsepower i'll be running. It's an 84 firebird if anyone wants to do a lil research on it....

I should have all the parts i need, it's just a matter of making time for it. I have an 84 MonteCarlo, 84 Z28, and an 84 Firebird....so i have the parts i need. As for transmissions, i have 2 TH-350's and TH-400's, as well as two 700R4's. I have more driveshafts than i know what to do with, and plenty of engines.... (vortech 350, sb 400, 383 stroker, 2 327's, 3 283's, and a 427 shortblock.). I'll just cut the motormounts out of the Monte Carlo and put them in the SL. I'm just unsure about what kind of space tolerance i'm dealing with for the tranny/driveshaft/rearend........ Oh well..... I'll figure it out
 
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