Hub centricity, please HELP

[madmikethespoon]

Ok I need some well informed opinions on this one. I currently have the opportunity to purchase a set of really nice 350Z rimes. They have the same bolt pattern and the off set is good. In fact I was able to try them on for a day, however, I hade some fitment issues. The problem was hardly noticeable when I first put them on. They seem to bolt up fine and damn did they look nice. I first noticed the problem when I got up to speed. About 50mph I noticed a shake in the steering wheel. I assumed it was the result of an imbalanced wheel. I would later be proven wrong. When I went to take them off I noticed the real problem at hand.



As I removed the wheel I knew something was wrong. I had all the lug nuts off but the wheel would come off no matter how hard I pulled. It took a good kick to the tire to release it. I then discovered the problem. My wheels like almost all modern wheels are hub centric, meaning they get centered on the car not by the lug nuts but by a rim in the center of the hub. The 350z wheels also had this feature; however the shape of the center ring is different. This diagram should demonstrate the difference.


Here you can see in black the shape of my wheel hub, and in blue the shape of the 350z wheel. You can see because the beveled edge of the wheel hits the center ring before it hits the back surface on the hub it prevents the wheel from seating properly. This is why the wheel wouldn’t come off easily. It had wedged the wheel bevel on to the centering ring on the hub. Although it would be very easy to grind that tiny bevel off the 350z wheel to insure that the rim fits flat against the hub, the question in my mind is both whether the rim will be centered as well as remain safe. On my OEM wheels that ring is used not only to center the wheel but to secure it as well, and is designed to fit snugly over it. So my question is whether it is a good idea to grind a portion of the beveled rim on the wheel off and hope it centers (as the lug nuts DO help to center the wheel) or not put the rims on at all. Any help on the matter would be greatly appreciated.


I have also found this as a resource in my quest for answers and may be helpful http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/te...cc_wheelguide/ if you go about a quarter of the way down the page you see a section called center that describes my problem well.

[G2Nice]

Good diagram and link, helps explain your problem. Can you get a machine shop to do the grinding perfect, so it will match perfectly to the hub? If you can't, I wouldn't risk it.
But then, wouldn't grinding the wheel make it weaker and unstable?

[madmikethespoon]

These are factory wheels so they are much much stronger than after market wheels so that doesnt bother me.

[PrimeUser]

Your diagram is the perfect recipe for poor fitment.

Being hub-centric means the small "snout" of the brake hub fits perfectly into the center hole of the wheel.

Right now, your diagram shows that the angled bevel is whats sitting (and interfering) on top of the hub. Obviously that's not correct at all.

I'm not sure why your wheels have that bevel at all, but it's definitely in the way.
You will have to do four things:

1. Get that wheel bevel ground down to clear the hub edges (best way), so that the wheel sits flush to the hub. Don't grind the corners of the hubs, or every time you change your rotors out, you'll be doing it all over again (worst way). Try to get the machine shop to radius and chamfer the edges so they're not creating a prime stress point on your wheels (IOW, a place to start cracking)...

2. If the small hub snout and matching recess on the wheel don't mate exactly and there is free space, you'll need to get hub centering rings to be sure the wheels will not get mounted off center. Any good aftermarket wheel shop in your area should have a small supply of the rings on hand, try there first.

3. Make sure your wheel mounting surface fits perfectly flat to the hub's flat mounting surface too (except of course for the hub snout which will stick into the wheel a bit).

4. Use the correct wheel lugs for your wheels, aftermarket "tuner" lugnuts are usually perfect for aftermarket wheels... That may NOT be correct for you though, since you're using OEM wheels from another car. Check it yourself to be absolutely sure.

These are just some of the pitfalls to using another cars wheels. Correct fitment is a rarity. The money saved by getting them cheaper, usually disappears quickly in paying for adapters and lugnuts to match.

[madmikethespoon]

has anyone had any experience with using factory wheels from another car? and if so what needed to be done in order for them to fit right

[marcmayer]

Originally Posted by madmikethespoon

Ok I need some well informed opinions on this one. I currently have the opportunity to purchase a set of really nice 350Z rimes. They have the same bolt pattern and the off set is good. In fact I was able to try them on for a day, however, I hade some fitment issues. The problem was hardly noticeable when I first put them on. They seem to bolt up fine and damn did they look nice. I first noticed the problem when I got up to speed. About 50mph I noticed a shake in the steering wheel. I assumed it was the result of an imbalanced wheel. I would later be proven wrong. When I went to take them off I noticed the real problem at hand.



As I removed the wheel I knew something was wrong. I had all the lug nuts off but the wheel would come off no matter how hard I pulled. It took a good kick to the tire to release it. I then discovered the problem. My wheels like almost all modern wheels are hub centric, meaning they get centered on the car not by the lug nuts but by a rim in the center of the hub. The 350z wheels also had this feature; however the shape of the center ring is different. This diagram should demonstrate the difference.


Here you can see in black the shape of my wheel hub, and in blue the shape of the 350z wheel. You can see because the beveled edge of the wheel hits the center ring before it hits the back surface on the hub it prevents the wheel from seating properly. This is why the wheel wouldn’t come off easily. It had wedged the wheel bevel on to the centering ring on the hub. Although it would be very easy to grind that tiny bevel off the 350z wheel to insure that the rim fits flat against the hub, the question in my mind is both whether the rim will be centered as well as remain safe. On my OEM wheels that ring is used not only to center the wheel but to secure it as well, and is designed to fit snugly over it. So my question is whether it is a good idea to grind a portion of the beveled rim on the wheel off and hope it centers (as the lug nuts DO help to center the wheel) or not put the rims on at all. Any help on the matter would be greatly appreciated.


I have also found this as a resource in my quest for answers and may be helpful Wheel Tech Guide - Tech - Sport Compact Car Magazine if you go about a quarter of the way down the page you see a section called center that describes my problem well.

I have the same issue with 350Z wheels on my TT. The stock hub diameter on the Nissan is 66.1mm and the stock hub diameter on the 3S is 67.1, so you have to remove about 1mm of aluminum from the rim. I bought the tool I needed to do this (a large hand reamer - size N) used on eBay for $10 + shipping. - see Used Adjustable Reamer - eBay (item 130252027938 end time Sep-09-08 16:33:07 PDT)

By opeing up the wheel hub this small amount you end up with perfect hub-centric fit.

[nawz8r]

One thing you may look into is wheel spacers that fit between the hub and rim. Different thicknesses, 3mm, etc. are available. Of course the wheel sticks out a little further. Hub centric rings are probably out because of the tapered center bore of the rim.