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Old 11-27-2005, 02:02 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

Well a couple weeks ago while in 5th gear the shifter would move backward when I pushed the gas pedal in and then move forward when I let off the gas. A couple days ago the transmission would pop out of 5th. So desided to do some searching on here and found many many people with the same problem. 90% of the replies to there peoples posts had to do with the 5th gear lock nut coming loose because the factory didn't do a proper job of 'locking' the nut in place. I decided to take my rear cover off of my transmission and have a look to see if this was the case for my transmission. Sure enough, it was.

Even though I stopped driving the car the day after 5th gear would pop out it was too late, some light damage had occured. However, this seems to only be light damage and I'm thankful that I stopped driving it when I did so as to not cause more damage.



I changed my tranmission fluid about 1.5 years ago and used Syncromesh. Those of you involved in those syncromesh battles I've included this picture of my fluid after I drained it today. When I first go my car about 3 years ago I decided to change the transmission fluid because I couldn't shift into 1st from 2nd unless I was almost at a complete stop and from 1st to 2nd the gears would grind a little bit. After putting Syncromesh in both of those issues were no more. I don't know if it was Syncomesh or the fact that the previous owner probably didn't change the tranny fluid since they bought the car new. Anyway, the sparkles in the fluid is bronze from what i'm assuming is the reverse brake ring. This is probably not due to the Syncromesh but rather because the lock nut is loose and the reverse brake ring is fucked (pictures somewhere below). I dunno, form your own opinion.



Ok this is what you will see when you take off the rear cover/end cap (minus the bronze ring that you will see in the below pictures). I had a tough time getting the cover off at first because the gasket material they used seemed to be holding it on. You can try hitting it with a rubber mallet and/or pry gently with a screw driver. The over must be pulled straight off (toward you) because there is a guide pin that alligns the cover. You can see this pin in the above picture just below the left middle bolt hole.



This next picture shows the reason why the lock nut is loose. As you can see the indented part of the nut is not enough to stay in the grooves. Stupid Mitshu.



Here's another one that's similar. Can anyone tell me what the part with the teeth are?


I'm assuming the part with the teeth is either #3 or #5. I think #1 is the bronze piece.




This is the bronze part that I keep refering to. I think this is #1 in the above image.


As you can see, it's f'ed.


I'm just wondering if I should replace the whole 5th speed synchronizer assembly to be on the save side. Does anyone know how much this would cost. After a visual inspection I can't see anything wrong with the assembly/hub. Perhaps I should take it off and inspect it more. Has anyone does this before that would like to comment on that?



This is a picture of the reverse brake cone and the wave spring. As you can see there was some rubbing between parts. The screws are loose in that picture, that's why the wear marks don't line up. In the upper left you can see that the wave spring is broken. I don't know how much, but both ends are jagged.

Does anyone have part numbers for these parts, or that program that can look up parts?

There are few more pictures that I didn't include, they all can be seen here:
http://68.0.230.238:81/trans/

Any comments or help from people whom have successfully repaired this problem would be great.
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Old 11-27-2005, 02:47 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

if you are planning to change out everything busted there is someone around this board that sells higher 5th gear. It was around $200 i think. Higher means it will go faster in 5th gear than stock at lower rmps. I am not sure what parts come with it but someone else might know.
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Old 11-28-2005, 10:34 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gavric
if you are planning to change out everything busted there is someone around this board that sells higher 5th gear. It was around $200 i think. Higher means it will go faster in 5th gear than stock at lower rmps. I am not sure what parts come with it but someone else might know.
teamripengineering has the upgraded 5th gear with syncho ring, new nuts, roll pin, installation instructions, etc for around $100.00
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Old 11-28-2005, 08:30 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

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Originally Posted by cbehnken
teamripengineering has the upgraded 5th gear with syncho ring, new nuts, roll pin, installation instructions, etc for around $100.00
actually, it's around $83 shipped iirc 80mph ~ 3krpm +/- a hundred rpm for me since.

other than that, you'll need the wave spring, probably a new pin for the gear fork to be safe, and any other damage that's occured to the assembly on the endcase where those lose screws are.
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Old 11-29-2005, 11:54 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

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Originally Posted by -bluej
actually, it's around $83 shipped iirc 80mph ~ 3krpm +/- a hundred rpm for me since.

other than that, you'll need the wave spring, probably a new pin for the gear fork to be safe, and any other damage that's occured to the assembly on the endcase where those lose screws are.

what percentage of a bigger gear did you get? the 8% or 16% (don't quote me on those numbers)? Also, do you know how to get that damn pin out that holds the shift fork to the shaft? the service manual just shows someone hammering it out, but they also had the tranny out of the car, i'm not doing that.
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Old 11-29-2005, 12:00 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

Quote:
Originally Posted by xstealthrtx
what percentage of a bigger gear did you get? the 8% or 16% (don't quote me on those numbers)? Also, do you know how to get that damn pin out that holds the shift fork to the shaft? the service manual just shows someone hammering it out, but they also had the tranny out of the car, i'm not doing that.
you need a punch tool to get the pin out and you'll of course be hammering on that but it's not all that difficult, just gotta get a punch that's the right size. you can't really use a tapered nail punch because it ends up inside the inner diameter of the pin (it's hollow) and gets wedged.

i forget exactly what one they sent me because i just got the one that was on sale, but I assume it was the "8%" one which IIRC when calculating the ratios is actually closer to 12% for our trannies.
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Old 11-29-2005, 12:25 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

Nice, thanks.

I just shot off an email to Jon at team RIP for more info on the 8%. If the price is right I might as well put a taller gear in there while i've got the damn thing open. most of my traveling is highway anyway, so this should work out.
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Old 12-01-2005, 10:14 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

My stealth does the same thing, but only in 4th gear. Is that the same problem??? And it's been doing it for a while now, so mine pretty f'ed then also i would guess.
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Old 12-01-2005, 11:50 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

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Originally Posted by grass058
My stealth does the same thing, but only in 4th gear. Is that the same problem??? And it's been doing it for a while now, so mine pretty f'ed then also i would guess.
well if the shifter moves a lot when in gear or pops out of gear when you go to accelerate it could be the synchros (most probable) or a shift rail or fork. how many miles on the tranny? any symptoms with fifth?

www.teamripengineering.com

they do really quality rebuilds with a good price if you can't do the work yourself or know someone who can. just remember that our FWD transmissions are nearly identical to the DSM trannies so anyone with experience with DSMs should be able to do a good job.
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Old 12-02-2005, 12:00 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: 5th gear popping out - pictures of parts (56K=no)

I had the same damn problem on my N/A. It ended up stripping my 5th gear down to nothing.
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